For anyone who doesn't know, this policy is for US armed forces, they won't ask you about your sexual preference when you sign up and you don't tell them what it is when you sign up. However, if they do find out you're a gay or lesbian, you will get booted out. Is this an OK thing to do? Obama recently had a speech to gays ( I think) about doing something about this policy. Should it be repealed or kept in place?

I think it should just be tweaked that they don't get kicked out, that seems like too much, after all it's another person fighting on our side. I can understand that some people get uncomfortable around gays but if your in the army you should be able to handle it. So, how do others feel about it?

If they wanna fight, let 'em. I don't see why it's such a big fuckin' deal in the first place.

Well as the only person in this forum that I know of that actually served in the armed forces (Army) I will weigh in. I think the rule is fine. This does not mean that homosexuals can't join. They do believe me. There were at least 4 or 5 that everyone I knew, knew were gay. It was never really a problem. But it can be. I was not in an Infantry unit. I was a mechanic attached to a Finance unit(pencil pushers). But in an Infantry unit you have to be able to trust the guy next to you. So really it can be seen as not only for moral, but also for the safety of the homosexual soldier. Also, many of these infantry units live in barracks with group showers. Now imagine if you as a male were allowed to shower with female soldiers. Not a problem right?

AarO)))n wrote:

Well as the only person in this forum that I know of that actually served in the armed forces (Army) I will weigh in. I think the rule is fine. This does not mean that homosexuals can't join. They do believe me. There were at least 4 or 5 that everyone I knew, knew were gay. It was never really a problem. But it can be. I was not in an Infantry unit. I was a mechanic attached to a Finance unit(pencil pushers). But in an Infantry unit you have to be able to trust the guy next to you. So really it can be seen as not only for moral, but also for the safety of the homosexual soldier. Also, many of these infantry units live in barracks with group showers. Now imagine if you as a male were allowed to shower with female soldiers. Not a problem right?

What difference would it make whether one was in an infantry unit or not? Obviously gays are already joining the military, so why would there be gays in an auxiliary unit, but not an infantry unit? I don't see how someone's sexual preference could possibly reflect on their combat performance.

Ziegenbartami wrote:

AarO)))n wrote:

Well as the only person in this forum that I know of that actually served in the armed forces (Army) I will weigh in. I think the rule is fine. This does not mean that homosexuals can't join. They do believe me. There were at least 4 or 5 that everyone I knew, knew were gay. It was never really a problem. But it can be. I was not in an Infantry unit. I was a mechanic attached to a Finance unit(pencil pushers). But in an Infantry unit you have to be able to trust the guy next to you. So really it can be seen as not only for moral, but also for the safety of the homosexual soldier. Also, many of these infantry units live in barracks with group showers. Now imagine if you as a male were allowed to shower with female soldiers. Not a problem right?

What difference would it make whether one was in an infantry unit or not? Obviously gays are already joining the military, so why would there be gays in an auxiliary unit, but not an infantry unit? I don't see how someone's sexual preference could possibly reflect on their combat performance.

I am not talking about combat performance. I am talking about moral and the ability to work together. Despite the world you would like to live in we don't live there yet. It can hurt moral in an Infantry unit to know that an openly gay man is in your platoon. Not only for the straight guys but also the gay guy. Take the NFL for example. There was a guy who came out after he retired. They asked him if he had come out during his career would it have been a problem. He said, "No doubt!" He also said there would be players going for his knees. Now what do you think might happen in a job where you are handed machine guns and live ammo? Again we don't live in fantasy world, we live in the real world. We would all like to think that everyone could see past it but they can't. Putting the countries security and the security of it's soldiers, gay or straight, is not worth it. The Armed Forces (infantry unit espeacially) is not full of the smartest guys in the world. Not being hurtful, just honest. Infantry units are usually full of guys who got low scores on the ASVAB, and had no other choice. These guys are also not usually the most open to homosexuals. Again this is for the gay guys safety also. If it ain't broke why fix it?

As a general policy, it works fine. In all aspects of life. Someone could be straight and just really effeminate. It's not entirely a great policy to just walk around asking people if they're gay, you know? It's a thing of mutual respect.

However, as one that automatically throws you out of the armed forces I disagree with it. A soldier is a soldier.

I would personally have no problem with it. A professional soldier is a professional soldier. I'd be willing to die for any man/woman willing to do so for me, regardless of sexual or religious preference.
Despite this, I can fully appreciate what Aaron is saying, and can see that many would not be able to get past this, especially in the United States. Not exactly the most tolerant culture, and completely overrun by religious righteousness.

I'd die for you John. <3

One thing I dont get, if they mind having gay people in the army, why not ask them before they join !? I mean, wtf ! they let a gay person in, he gets involved in army life and it basically becomes his life, then he gets kicked when someone finds out he's gay ! wtf is he supposed to do then ? that's just wrong. Other than that, I agree with most points Aaron stated.

Mostafa wrote:

I'd die for you John. <3

One thing I dont get, if they mind having gay people in the army, why not ask them before they join !? I mean, wtf ! they let a gay person in, he gets involved in army life and it basically becomes his life, then he gets kicked when someone finds out he's gay ! wtf is he supposed to do then ? that's just wrong. Other than that, I agree with most points Aaron stated.

Its the old "Ignorance is Bliss" argument. You don't know someones gay? Generally you don't care. There are a lot of homophobic people who are somewhat wary of them, in case they hit on them or something. And like Aaron said, the whole showering issue...Basically its just those who cant accept someone for who they are and are uncomfortable with the prospect of their different sexual orientation. Quite frankly the current system is the most practical; its a shame they can't be open about themselves, but better they hide it than risk unnecessary tension.

"Ask no questions and I shall tell no lies."

Mostafa wrote:

I'd die for you John. <3

One thing I dont get, if they mind having gay people in the army, why not ask them before they join !? I mean, wtf ! they let a gay person in, he gets involved in army life and it basically becomes his life, then he gets kicked when someone finds out he's gay ! wtf is he supposed to do then ? that's just wrong. Other than that, I agree with most points Aaron stated.

They don't ask for many reasons. One, because it doesn't and shouldn't matter. Two, because they really don't care. Three(and most important), the Military needs any and all and they can't afford to cut out anyone who is willing to sign up. Also, as long as you keep it to yourself, no one is going to ask. You can get into A LOT of trouble for asking. The "openly" gay guys that I knew in the Army were never with other men in public and we knew they were gay because of the actions(not sexual sorry guys ). It never really bothered me as long as they were not hitting on the rest of us straight guys, which they never did. It is not as though they follow you around 24/7. If you were gay you could find you a partner or some sex as easy as if you were straight. You just have to keep it on the dl. As I said before. This rule is for the safety of the unit and the homosexual. Remember I am only talking about the Army. This does not account for the Navy where you are living in much closer quarters and for long periods of time at sea.

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